I am grieved that New York City is planning to take the unwise step of removing 68 churches from the spaces that they rent in public schools. It is my conviction that those churches housed in schools are invaluable assets to the neighborhoods that they serve. Churches have long been seen as positive additions to communities. Family stability, resources for those in need, and compassion for the marginalized are all positive influences that neighborhood churches provide. There are many with first-hand experience who will claim that the presence of churches in a neighborhood can lead to a drop in crime.
The great diversity of our city means that we will never all agree completely on anything. And we cherish our city’s reputation for tolerance of differing opinions and beliefs. Therefore, we should all mourn if disagreement with certain beliefs of the church is allowed to unduly influence the formation of just policy and practice.
I disagree with the opinion written by Judge Pierre Leval that: “A worship service is an act of organized religion that consecrates the place in which it is performed, making it a church.” This is an erroneous theological judgment; I know of no Christian church or denomination that believes that merely holding a service in a building somehow “consecrates” it, setting it apart from all common or profane use. To base a legal opinion on such a superstitious view is surely invalid. Conversely, we concur with Judge John Walker’s dissenting opinion that this ban constitutes viewpoint discrimination and raises no legitimate Establishment Clause concerns.
A disproportionate number of churches that are affected by this prohibition are not wealthy, established communities of faith. They are ones who possess the fewest resources and many work with the poor. Redeemer has many ties with those churches and their pastors, and our church community invests time and resources to assist them to be good neighbors in their communities.
Let them be those good neighbors. I am hopeful that the leaders of New York City and the legislators of New York State will see the value of a society that encourages all spheres of culture—the church, government, education, business, etc—to work together for human flourishing.
Dr. Timothy Keller
Senior Pastor
Redeemer Presbyterian Church
Released to A Journey for publication this morning by Redeemer Presbyterian Church.
FYI Donna Lieberman, the executive director of the New York Civil Liberties Union, is in favor of the ousting of any worship services from public schools. See this debate between her and Jeremy Del Rio on NY1.
Maybe someone should call the ACLU so they can protect these assembly and speech rights.
By taking away the churches he will be taking away a persons right to choose. These churches are not hurting anyone and help as many as they can. Its awful that a country that was created out of a need for freedom of religion is trying to take that freedom away.
Agreed.
If the history of New York City is any indication, then the future of it is at stake. If it were not for churches, consider the hell-hole it would be today.
The churches are not meeting during school hours. I just don’t see the problem. This harmful and misguided decision is oppressive. I hope it does not stand.
Liz,
I think there is a misunderstanding.
These churches do NOT maintain a permanent presence – they merely rent space in the school on Sundays for worship. Much the same as some churches do when they rent out a movie theatre. Probably the school is more cost-effective and more centrally located for these congregations.
Given the current state of taxes in NYC where I live (very high) it is insane for the city to refuse a source of income.
Then again, this is the same mayor that attempted to force medical professionals who are pro-life to perform or participate in abortions. That didn’t get too far, thank the Lord.
In the ’80’s in Texas, my Fellowship of Christian Athletes club met off of school grounds because we were very clearly a religious organization. We did not feel discriminated against, and actually appreciated the general rule. It seemed respectful and encouraging of tolerance among all students. We are a multi-religious society now, and if public schools are to permit one religion to office on their publicly funded property, then any religious affiliation may do so. Frankly, in my upbringing, school was school and church was church. I went to the Catholic church and did not presume to insist that my church be permitted to have a presence at my school which was paid for by everyone, including non-Catholics.
Gillian, this issue was already considered by the U.S. Supreme Court and it had decided not to review the case. There is no appeal to a higher court since the U.S. Supreme Court is as high as it can go. The only option left is to have legislation passed in the state. From what I’ve heard, it has already passed the State Assembly, it needs to pass the State Senate now.
Klaus, your argument is correct in that the schools should not favor one group or another. But your agreeing that the churches be pulled out of school contradicts your argument. By not allowing churches to stay, the schools are favoring others such as non-religious groups. So It’s OK for a club to hold a social event at the school or to use the gym to play sports, but its not OK for a church to use the school for a worship service?
“A worship service is an act of organized religion that consecrates the place in which it is performed, making it a church.”
Looking at this statement/justification/theology published begins make me asked the question of; if this is what we are to go by, then last year on September 11 ,2011, did they (government officials) not commit this same exact act at the Ground Zero site, on a special guest list basis, so what kind of church did they plant there??? Are they preaching that people who get together to better the communities on their own time and with their own resources are terrorists, and need to be excommunicated from their religion??? Sadly this is the case they have laid out, yet we cannot let our hope diminish that this erroneous ideation would continue down this road.
Thanks be to God and to His Son Jesus Christ, with all honor, praise and glory. Jesus already completed His work at the Cross, once and for all. Actions like these we are warned of in Mark 13 and 1 John 4:1-6, no surprise here, let us dig down deeper than ever before and face these days boldly, in the witness of Our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. ” Let us rejoice in Our Lord together in this time of mourning, Thank you LORD!!!
What he said – and said very well.
It’s interesting that U.S. courts have recognized various doctrines to account for their own lack of expertise on a given subject. The Business Judgment Rule, for example, suggests that courts defer to the business decisions that a corporation’s Board of Director’s makes, because judges are not business men, and thus lack the requisite understanding of the subject to properly analyze the appropriateness of these decisions. Here, however, we have a judge who has decided that he is appropriately qualified to make certain broad theological statements in justification of his position. I’d be interested to read his thoughts on the religious consecration of buildings in a proper theological treatise.
Thanks Gillian Burleson for setting the record straight. That needs to be spoken loud and CLEAR!!!!
I surely hope this can be appealed to a higher court. This is the very kind of discrimination a Darien, CT, BAptist minister was protesting in the early 19th century) when he wrote to Thomas Jefferson asking for clarification about the freedom of religion clause in the First Amendment. Thomas Jefferson’s reply has been misquoted continually in the last half century. He indicated that a wall of separation between the state and the church should protect the church from interference by the state–not the other way around, as countless thousands of post-modernists would have it. He always understood religious belief to be important in informing the direction of government and the attitude of the culture.
Like this.
Thanks, I like this.
Great!
I like this.
I like the article.
A breathe of fresh air.
Like the piece.
I agree.
Great rejoinder by Keller
Excellent Op-Ed by Tim Keller of Redeemer Presbyterian Church of NYC regarding NYC’s decision to ban churches from meeting in public schools. Thank you, Redeemer, for making your significant voice heard.
A little late to the party but welcome, nonetheless.
It is great to see our church leaders in New York City publicly standing up. The current protest started as a grassroots movement of small churches, but I am overjoyed that pastors with influence are stepping into the fight.
I went on a hunger strike and was arrested twice for the cause. Although our protest has grown day by day, pastors are now being forced out of the city as their meeting locations are shut with no ready alternatives.
This is a sad time in our city’s history when our neighborhoods are losing services without adequate planning for the consequences. It is interesting that we live in a time in which a person can feel so offended about other groups that he denies everyone else in the community their feelings and beliefs.
Praise goes out to the three reverend doctors Timothy Keller, A.R. Bernard and Floyd H. Flake for lending support at the time when it is needed most. Each of these men know the mayor personally and have the love of many Americans. The word is out that Pastor Rick Warren may throw his weight into raising the question of the injustice that is happening in NYC.
If something does not change, our city will face the result of carelessly displacing thousands of people from their churches. Furthermore, even secular New Yorkers will suffer as our poor lose their social support network. Who will be crying and weeping with them?
I went to the mayor’s house last Wednesday morning, and I saw how addicting it could be for any person to be surrounded by the massed livery of uniformed cops, lines of SUV’s and 30 undercover officers protecting you for a 5 block radius. God help Mayor Bloomberg.
If you have any questions or want to help, email me: infinitynychurch@gmail.com
Dr. Keller’s is an emotionally and intellectually sound response to the convoluted decision to evict schools as rent-paying tenants from NYC school facilities. Ironically, the nature of the court’s reasoning is religious and theological in nature, while the relationship sought by church tenants is fiscal and pragmatic. The term “consecration” implies exclusive use of a space for religious purposes. Have church tenants asked that school buildings no longer be used for educational purposes? Since they have not, the suggestion that churches intend to “consecrate” these spaces is clearly being projected upon them by secular authorities. I am struck by the number of irreligious people who have no desire to promote religion, but who view this decision as unconstitutional and oppressive. May reason prevail.
Great article. Pulling churches out of public schools is actually quite stupid and irresponsible. There is no valid reason to refuse revenue (it is a business transaction and source of income for the schools) and at the same time continue going back to city taxpayers and saying we need to raise taxes to pay for the schools…
klaus, I would not say that churches are a private matter at all. There is a distinction between personal and private. Are Christian beliefs personal? Yes. Are they private? No. Christians are those who believe certain things to be true and strive to live lives according to that truth. The same could be said of the Boy Scouts, the Rotary Club or Shriners. Kicking churches out of schools because Christian beliefs find their center in the metaphysical as opposed to Godless Post-Enlightenment humanism is religious descrimination no matter which way you paint it.
I just called the speaker and emailed the remaining Assembly members (as per Rich Swingle’s advice above). Please no crying — lets take our “public space” back — call and write.
I think its agood idea that they pull the churchs out of the schools.
Churches are a private matter, and school that are public should not be seen to favour one or the other group.
Positive article.
Thanks. Like the article.
I appreciate the posting.
Let’s hope the NYT and other mainstream news media picks this up.
Political correctness, Government Atheism and 1st Amendment Confusion just completely out of control in New York City and federal courts.
This is just another step towards the downfall of America. We were once a proud country leading with God’s principles, The day will come when everyone will have regrets.
good stuff here.
A welcomed word.
Like this too.
I also like this.
I like Pastor Keller’s remarks.
Thanks, Pastor Keller.
I also like this OpEd.
I like this OpEd.
really? churches can no longer meet in nyc schools?
Thank you, Pastor Tim Keller, for standing with 60+ churches that Mike Bloomberg intends to evict from public spaces this Sunday.
This morning in the New York Times (article below) Speaker Silver was quoted as saying, “It would open up the schools to anybody. It might include the Ku Klux Klan.” The Ku Klux Klan is not a religious organization and is therefore already allowed to use school property on off hours as a social group. Call speaker Silver at 518-455-3791 and tell him his argument is not valid and that he should vote to pass A8800. I just called, and his secretary was very pleasant.
Also, churches are being evicted from schools because US Supreme Court decided not to weigh in on this issue, but that may be because it already ruled on the same issue in the case of Good News Club vs. Milford Central School. The bill (http://assembly.state.ny.us/leg/?default_fld=&bn=A08800&term=&Summary=Y&Actions=Y&Votes=Y&Memo=Y&Text=Y) says:
…that it was unconstitutional for a public school
district in upstate New
York to exclude from its facilities “a private Christian organization
for children, and the Supreme Court further held in the Good News
Club case that “by denying the club access to the school’s limited
public forum on the ground that the club was religious in nature,
Milford discriminated against the club because of its religious
viewpoint in violation of the free speech clause.
Please send an email to Assembly members urging them to vote to pass A8800: http://www.righttoworship.com/political_action